The Social-Engineer Podcast

Welcome to the Social-Engineer Podcast: The SE Etc. Series. This series will be hosted by Chris Hadnagy, CEO of Social-Engineer LLC, and The Innocent Lives Foundation, as well as Social-Engineer.Org and The Institute for Social Engineering. Chris will be joined by his co-host Patrick Laverty as they discuss topics pertaining to the world of Social Engineering. [Nov 28, 2022] 


00:00 – Intro 

00:24 – Patrick Laverty Intro 

00:43 – Intro Links 

03:26 – Todays Topic: How do you become a Social Engineer? 

05:16 – The Art of the Conversation  

05:36 – The old college try! 

07:49 – It's all in the report 

11:37 – OSINT: The SE Lifeblood 

13:53 – How do you learn this? 

16:48 – Don't rely on tools, rely on OSINT 

19:14 – The APSE origin story  

25:13 – It's really about communication  

25:45 – Learning from DISC 

29:24 – It's not all bad 

30:24 – This isn't 9 to 5 

33:50 – Conversation with a purpose 

34:57 – Back to the reports 

38:27 – APSE and beyond 

43:36 – Sorry...Invite Only 

45:50 – 'Tis the season 

46:41 – Never stop learning 

48:27 – Always different, never boring  

49:32 – The next generation  

51:28 – Coming up next month 

52:03 – Wrap Up & Outro 


Find us online 

  • Chris Hadnagy 
  • Patrick Laverty 


Marc Ashworth is a respected IT executive with over 30 years of experience in cyber and physical security, IT/security architecture, project management, is an author and a public speaker.  He is a board member of the St. Louis Chapter of InfraGard, Webster University Cyber Advisory board, Co-Founded the State of Cyber annual security conference, and a Lifetime member of FBI Citizens Academy, possessing security certifications in CISSP, CISM, CRISC, Security+ and other certifications.  As the Senior Vice President and Chief Information Security Officer at First Bank, Marc currently oversees First Bank’s information security, fraud, physical security, and the network services departments. He is also the 2022 Cyber Defense Magazine winner of “Top 100 CISOs in the World.” [Nov 21st, 2022] 


00:00 – Intro 

00:49 – Intro Links: 

03:15 – Marc Ashworth Intro 

05:17 – What was the path that led you to InfoSec? 

07:41 – Cultivating good security practices 

09:31 – Learning to "scale" your security 

11:22 – The value of Strategic Thinking 

13:40 – It's all in the presentation 

15:25 – The importance of Customer Service 

18:32 – The Art of Translation 

21:32 – Small Wins 

24:34 – Letters to a young CISO 

26:20 – Don't avoid Pen Testing! 

28:11 – Adopting a "Partnership" mindset 

30:30 – Long line of influence 

33:40 – Book Recommendations 

36:14 – Find Marc Ashworth online 

38:36 – Wrap Up  

38:56 – Outro 


Today we are joined by Stephanie Paul. Stephanie is an actress, a trainer, and keynote speaker. She has over 30 years of experience in the entertainment industry and she uses that now as she coaches and trains executives, sales teams, Tedx speakers and experts of all kinds to become master communicators. She is also a proud member of EOA and on the board of the directors of the Alzheimer’s Association in Orange County. She is an active member of WIB, and the Vice Chair of Young Women in Bio. 

[Nov 14th, 2022] 

00:00 – Intro  

00:23 – Intro Links 

02:10 – Stephanie Paul Intro 

02:59 – How did you go from acting to coaching communications? 

06:34 – Dark Side of the Moon 

08:03 – The Magic of Story 

09:14 – Can anyone learn to use storytelling? 

11:43 – Practice, practice, practice! 

13:49 – How is storytelling used in Leadership? 

16:31 – Reflecting your values 

18:15 – The beauty of mistakes 

21:32 – You're not born with it! 

23:28 – Mentorship 

28:32 – The importance of Accountability 

30:10 – Make them want the banana 

33:24 – Valley Girl 

35:39 – Find Stephanie Paul online 

36:50 – Women In Leadership 

37:49 – Book Recommendations: 

40:55 Who are your greatest mentors? 

44:42 – Guest Wrap Up 

45:17 – Outro 

Welcome to the Social-Engineer Podcast: The Doctor Is In Series – where we will discuss understandings and developments in the field of psychology.  


In today’s episode, Chris and Abbie are not just going to talk about nonverbal communication at an observational level, but lay the ground work for a deeper understanding of nonverbals. Not just what certain behaviors tell us but WHY they tell us this, and where nonverbal communication originated from! [Nov 07, 2022] 


00:00 – Intro 

00:17 – Dr. Abbie Maroño Intro 

01:10 – Intro Links 

04:01 – The topic of the day: Nonverbal Communication 

10:25 – Everything comes back to Darwin 

15:25 – In Utero 

18:54 – A picture speaks 1000 words 

20:31 – More "nature" than "nurture" 

23:20 – Cultural vs Universal Gestures 

27:17 – Looking at "Intention" 

32:24 – Linking Non-verbals to Intention 

36:32 – The Doctor is REALLY in! 

38:37 – Don't Look Up (or away!) 

42:35 – Response Behavior 

46:58 – Neuroception - Trust your gut! 

53:48 – The Takeaway 

56:04 – Man's Best Friend 

57:13 – Wrap Up  

58:53 – Book Recommendations 


Select research: 

Allen, S. (2018). The science of awe (pp. 58-69). Greater Good Science: John Templeton Foundation. 

Bargh J, Chartrand T (1999) The unbearable automaticity of being. Am Psychol 54: 462–479. 

Bousmalis, K., Mehu, M., & Pantic, M. (2013). Towards the automatic detection of spontaneous agreement and disagreement based on nonverbal behaviour: A survey of related cues, databases, and tools. Image and vision computing, 31(2), 203-221. 

Bryant, G. A. (2020). Evolution, structure, and functions of human laughter. In The handbook of communication science and biology (pp. 63-77). Routledge. 

Chakrabarty, S., Widing, R. E., & Brown, G. (2014). Selling behaviours and sales performance: the moderating and mediating effects of interpersonal mentalizing. Journal of Personal Selling & Sales Management, 34(2), 112-122. 

Chen M, Bargh JA (1999) Consequences of automatic evaluation: Immediate behavioral predispositions to approach or avoid the stimulus. Pers Soc Psychol B 25: 215–224. 

Demuru, E., & Giacoma, C. (2022). Interacting primates: the biological roots of human communication. Ethology Ecology & Evolution, 34(3), 201-204. 

Ekman, P. (1971). Universals and cultural differences in facial expressions of emotion. In Nebraska symposium on motivation. University of Nebraska Press. 

Ekman, P., & Keltner, D. (1973). Universal facial expressions of emotion. Studia Psychologica, 15(2), 140-147. 

Gordon, R. A., & Druckman, D. (2018). Nonverbal behaviour as communication: Approaches, issues, and research. In The handbook of communication skills (pp. 81-134). Routledge. 

Heuer, K., Rinck, M., & Becker, E. S. (2007). Avoidance of emotional facial expressions in social anxiety: The approach–avoidance task. Behaviour research and therapy, 45(12), 2990-3001. 

Mathis, V., & Kenny, P. J. (2018). Neuroscience: brain mechanisms of blushing. Current Biology, 28(14), R791-R792. 

Müller, P., Huang, M. X., & Bulling, A. (2018, March). Detecting low rapport during natural interactions in small groups from non-verbal behaviour. In 23rd International Conference on Intelligent User Interfaces (pp. 153-164). 

Neidlinger, K., Truong, K. P., Telfair, C., Feijs, L., Dertien, E., & Evers, V. (2017, March). AWElectric: that gave me goosebumps, did you feel it too?. In Proceedings of the Eleventh International Conference on Tangible, Embedded, and Embodied Interaction (pp. 315-324). 

Parr, L. A., Micheletta, J., & Waller, B. M. (2016). Nonverbal communication in primates: Observational and experimental approaches. 

Pohjavaara, P., Telaranta, T., & Väisänen, E. (2003). The role of the sympathetic nervous system in anxiety: is it possible to relieve anxiety with endoscopic sympathetic block?. Nordic journal of psychiatry, 57(1), 55-60. 

Reissland, N., & Austen, J. (2018). Goal directed behaviours: the development of pre-natal touch behaviours. In Reach-to-Grasp Behavior (pp. 3-17). Routledge. 

Schug, J., Matsumoto, D., Horita, Y., Yamagishi, T., & Bonnet, K. (2010). Emotional expressivity as a signal of cooperation. Evolution and Human Behavior, 31(2), 87-94. 

Segerstråle, U., & Molnár, P. (2018). Nonverbal communication: where nature meets culture. Routledge. 

Waterson, R. H., Lander, E. S., & Wilson, R. K. (2005). Initial sequence of the chimpanzee genome and comparison with the human genome. Nature, 437(7055), 69. 

White, P. (2016). Reading the Blush. Configurations, 24(3), 281-301. 

Woud, M. L., Maas, J., Becker, E. S., & Rinck, M. (2013). Make the manikin move: Symbolic approach–avoidance responses affect implicit and explicit face evaluations. Journal of Cognitive Psychology, 25(6), 738-744.